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MicroLevel 2

KV
Keith V
Thu, Mar 31, 2022 6:31 PM

Well, looks like i need to redesign MicroLevel. It has a couple of obsolete parts that i can no longer get

Now is the time to add features or fix existing features. Personally i think its perfect except the connection scheme could be cleaner and better.

Im thinking about adding BLE so we can talk to from a phone or computer.
But i done see any real advantage to having an app, just more complexity.

Any thoughts? Wishes?

Thanks,
keith vasilakes
76 royale

Well, looks like i need to redesign MicroLevel. It has a couple of obsolete parts that i can no longer get Now is the time to add features or fix existing features. Personally i think its perfect except the connection scheme could be cleaner and better. Im thinking about adding BLE so we can talk to from a phone or computer. But i done see any real advantage to having an app, just more complexity. Any thoughts? Wishes? Thanks, keith vasilakes 76 royale
BV
Bill Van Vlack
Thu, Mar 31, 2022 7:20 PM

Ability to add a preset 'high' position.
Analog height outputs for the EBL ADC inputs.

Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

Ability to add a preset 'high' position. Analog height outputs for the EBL ADC inputs. -- Bill Van Vlack '76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid November 2015.
RK
Russell Keith
Thu, Mar 31, 2022 8:46 PM

Hi Keith,
I don't have the MicroLevel yet, but I am planning for one.  I have a '78, and the auto ride height does not work.

First of all, thank you for developing this, and for sharing it with the GMC Community.

I like the idea of having the option of a couple of non-ride height programmable set points, either high for in-town driving into gas stations, etc.,
or lower than ride height for smooth interstate travel, or a preset black tank dumping mode, etc.  However, it you do arrange for other presets, maybe
there should be an indicator light for when the coach is at the correct ride height.

How about an indicator light for when the compressor is running. (it may have this already, I don't know)

I like to know air bag pressures, but that might increase the cost too much. Something like this:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/data/6986/medium/New_Suspension_Air_Bellows_Pressure_Gauge_from_Dakota_Digital.jpg

If you do monitor pressures, maybe add an alarm for unplanned pressure loss, or a high-pressure alarm if it tries to raise the coach too much.

Maybe a kill switch for all the power when its in storage, so the remote control sensor does not drain the battery.

BTW, I have a few questions regarding the MicroLevel.

I am planning to replace my compressors and air lines when I upgrade to the microlevel.  With the microlevel, could I continue to use two compressors?
My '78 has two compressors and no air tank.  Or would you recommend just one compressor and a tank? Or one compressor and no tank?  Are any air lines
required to come up to the control unit? On the microlevel, does it lose its calibration when I disconnect the coach battery?

How many units have you sold? How has the feedback been from the users?  Have you made any arrangements for GMC shops to install them?  We have had
Jeff Sirum do some stuff on our coach that I didn't want to tackle, like the timing chain most recently.

Thanks for your time,
Russell

--
Russell Keith,
1978 E2 "Harry" 403 (still carbureted), Danny Dunn Tranny, Thorley, Stock Brakes w/Remote Vacuum Brake Booster, Quad Bags, Dakota Digital Dash, 6.5 kW
Onan, Dunedin, Florida

Hi Keith, I don't have the MicroLevel yet, but I am planning for one. I have a '78, and the auto ride height does not work. First of all, thank you for developing this, and for sharing it with the GMC Community. I like the idea of having the option of a couple of non-ride height programmable set points, either high for in-town driving into gas stations, etc., or lower than ride height for smooth interstate travel, or a preset black tank dumping mode, etc. However, it you do arrange for other presets, maybe there should be an indicator light for when the coach is at the correct ride height. How about an indicator light for when the compressor is running. (it may have this already, I don't know) I like to know air bag pressures, but that might increase the cost too much. Something like this: http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/data/6986/medium/New_Suspension_Air_Bellows_Pressure_Gauge_from_Dakota_Digital.jpg If you do monitor pressures, maybe add an alarm for unplanned pressure loss, or a high-pressure alarm if it tries to raise the coach too much. Maybe a kill switch for all the power when its in storage, so the remote control sensor does not drain the battery. BTW, I have a few questions regarding the MicroLevel. I am planning to replace my compressors and air lines when I upgrade to the microlevel. With the microlevel, could I continue to use two compressors? My '78 has two compressors and no air tank. Or would you recommend just one compressor and a tank? Or one compressor and no tank? Are any air lines required to come up to the control unit? On the microlevel, does it lose its calibration when I disconnect the coach battery? How many units have you sold? How has the feedback been from the users? Have you made any arrangements for GMC shops to install them? We have had Jeff Sirum do some stuff on our coach that I didn't want to tackle, like the timing chain most recently. Thanks for your time, Russell -- Russell Keith, 1978 E2 "Harry" 403 (still carbureted), Danny Dunn Tranny, Thorley, Stock Brakes w/Remote Vacuum Brake Booster, Quad Bags, Dakota Digital Dash, 6.5 kW Onan, Dunedin, Florida
KV
Keith V
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 2:32 PM

Ive looked into putting into more height positions but it really adds complexity and I'm not convinced it's necessary, just hit the up button and let it either go all the way up or just count to 3.

As far as air bag pressures, why not just add that gauge and pressure sensors, there's no need for microlevel to be in-between that, and no need to mess with an app.

But I will look into it and see if there is an easy way to solve it.

The ride height indicator  might be a good idea, there are currently 4 LED indicators showing which valves are on, so if you are in travel mode and no valves are on it's at ride height. but it's not that obvious....Hmmmm
That and other indicators might not be a bad idea, but isn't that what the telltale lights are for?

as far compressors, the EL2 system is a terrible design. Those 2 tiny compressors are ridiculously small. A good design is 1 big compressor and a small tank. the Viair 450 or 485 is perfect, a 1 gallon tank is good.
no air lines go to the controller, just to the valve block.
All calibration data is stored in non volatile flash and will survive power loss for like 10,000 years šŸ™‚
I've sold quite a few units >10  <100 with very few issues, most issues are installation issues.
There's no reason a GMC shop couldn't do the install, the coop was involved in one and I'd be happy to work with them


From: Russell Keith rkeith1631@gmail.com
Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 3:46 PM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2

Hi Keith,
I don't have the MicroLevel yet, but I am planning for one.  I have a '78, and the auto ride height does not work.

First of all, thank you for developing this, and for sharing it with the GMC Community.

I like the idea of having the option of a couple of non-ride height programmable set points, either high for in-town driving into gas stations, etc.,
or lower than ride height for smooth interstate travel, or a preset black tank dumping mode, etc.  However, it you do arrange for other presets, maybe
there should be an indicator light for when the coach is at the correct ride height.

How about an indicator light for when the compressor is running. (it may have this already, I don't know)

I like to know air bag pressures, but that might increase the cost too much. Something like this:
http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/data/6986/medium/New_Suspension_Air_Bellows_Pressure_Gauge_from_Dakota_Digital.jpg

If you do monitor pressures, maybe add an alarm for unplanned pressure loss, or a high-pressure alarm if it tries to raise the coach too much.

Maybe a kill switch for all the power when its in storage, so the remote control sensor does not drain the battery.

BTW, I have a few questions regarding the MicroLevel.

I am planning to replace my compressors and air lines when I upgrade to the microlevel.  With the microlevel, could I continue to use two compressors?
My '78 has two compressors and no air tank.  Or would you recommend just one compressor and a tank? Or one compressor and no tank?  Are any air lines
required to come up to the control unit? On the microlevel, does it lose its calibration when I disconnect the coach battery?

How many units have you sold? How has the feedback been from the users?  Have you made any arrangements for GMC shops to install them?  We have had
Jeff Sirum do some stuff on our coach that I didn't want to tackle, like the timing chain most recently.

Thanks for your time,
Russell

--
Russell Keith,
1978 E2 "Harry" 403 (still carbureted), Danny Dunn Tranny, Thorley, Stock Brakes w/Remote Vacuum Brake Booster, Quad Bags, Dakota Digital Dash, 6.5 kW
Onan, Dunedin, Florida


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Ive looked into putting into more height positions but it really adds complexity and I'm not convinced it's necessary, just hit the up button and let it either go all the way up or just count to 3. As far as air bag pressures, why not just add that gauge and pressure sensors, there's no need for microlevel to be in-between that, and no need to mess with an app. But I will look into it and see if there is an easy way to solve it. The ride height indicator might be a good idea, there are currently 4 LED indicators showing which valves are on, so if you are in travel mode and no valves are on it's at ride height. but it's not that obvious....Hmmmm That and other indicators might not be a bad idea, but isn't that what the telltale lights are for? as far compressors, the EL2 system is a terrible design. Those 2 tiny compressors are ridiculously small. A good design is 1 big compressor and a small tank. the Viair 450 or 485 is perfect, a 1 gallon tank is good. no air lines go to the controller, just to the valve block. All calibration data is stored in non volatile flash and will survive power loss for like 10,000 years šŸ™‚ I've sold quite a few units >10 <100 with very few issues, most issues are installation issues. There's no reason a GMC shop couldn't do the install, the coop was involved in one and I'd be happy to work with them ________________________________ From: Russell Keith <rkeith1631@gmail.com> Sent: Thursday, March 31, 2022 3:46 PM To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org <gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2 Hi Keith, I don't have the MicroLevel yet, but I am planning for one. I have a '78, and the auto ride height does not work. First of all, thank you for developing this, and for sharing it with the GMC Community. I like the idea of having the option of a couple of non-ride height programmable set points, either high for in-town driving into gas stations, etc., or lower than ride height for smooth interstate travel, or a preset black tank dumping mode, etc. However, it you do arrange for other presets, maybe there should be an indicator light for when the coach is at the correct ride height. How about an indicator light for when the compressor is running. (it may have this already, I don't know) I like to know air bag pressures, but that might increase the cost too much. Something like this: http://www.gmcmhphotos.com/photos/data/6986/medium/New_Suspension_Air_Bellows_Pressure_Gauge_from_Dakota_Digital.jpg If you do monitor pressures, maybe add an alarm for unplanned pressure loss, or a high-pressure alarm if it tries to raise the coach too much. Maybe a kill switch for all the power when its in storage, so the remote control sensor does not drain the battery. BTW, I have a few questions regarding the MicroLevel. I am planning to replace my compressors and air lines when I upgrade to the microlevel. With the microlevel, could I continue to use two compressors? My '78 has two compressors and no air tank. Or would you recommend just one compressor and a tank? Or one compressor and no tank? Are any air lines required to come up to the control unit? On the microlevel, does it lose its calibration when I disconnect the coach battery? How many units have you sold? How has the feedback been from the users? Have you made any arrangements for GMC shops to install them? We have had Jeff Sirum do some stuff on our coach that I didn't want to tackle, like the timing chain most recently. Thanks for your time, Russell -- Russell Keith, 1978 E2 "Harry" 403 (still carbureted), Danny Dunn Tranny, Thorley, Stock Brakes w/Remote Vacuum Brake Booster, Quad Bags, Dakota Digital Dash, 6.5 kW Onan, Dunedin, Florida _______________________________________________ GMCnet mailing list Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
KV
Keith V
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 2:37 PM

Ive looked into putting into more height positions but it really adds complexity and I'm not convinced it's necessary, just hit the up button and let it either go all the way up or just count to 3.

As far as air bag pressures, why not just add that gauge and pressure sensors, there's no need for microlevel to be in-between that, and no need to mess with an app.

But I will look into it and see if there is an easy way to solve it.

The ride height indicator  might be a good idea, there are currently 4 LED indicators showing which valves are on, so if you are in travel mode and no valves are on it's at ride height. but it's not that obvious....Hmmmm
That and other indicators might not be a bad idea, but isn't that what the telltale lights are for?

as far compressors, the EL2 system is a terrible design. Those 2 tiny compressors are ridiculously small. A good design is 1 big compressor and a small tank. the Viair 450 or 485 is perfect, a 1 gallon tank is good.
no air lines go to the controller, just to the valve block.
All calibration data is stored in non volatile flash and will survive power loss for like 10,000 years šŸ™‚
I've sold quite a few units >10  <100 with very few issues, most issues are installation issues.
There's no reason a GMC shop couldn't do the install, the coop was involved in one and I'd be happy to work with them


Ive looked into putting into more height positions but it really adds complexity and I'm not convinced it's necessary, just hit the up button and let it either go all the way up or just count to 3. As far as air bag pressures, why not just add that gauge and pressure sensors, there's no need for microlevel to be in-between that, and no need to mess with an app. But I will look into it and see if there is an easy way to solve it. The ride height indicator might be a good idea, there are currently 4 LED indicators showing which valves are on, so if you are in travel mode and no valves are on it's at ride height. but it's not that obvious....Hmmmm That and other indicators might not be a bad idea, but isn't that what the telltale lights are for? as far compressors, the EL2 system is a terrible design. Those 2 tiny compressors are ridiculously small. A good design is 1 big compressor and a small tank. the Viair 450 or 485 is perfect, a 1 gallon tank is good. no air lines go to the controller, just to the valve block. All calibration data is stored in non volatile flash and will survive power loss for like 10,000 years šŸ™‚ I've sold quite a few units >10 <100 with very few issues, most issues are installation issues. There's no reason a GMC shop couldn't do the install, the coop was involved in one and I'd be happy to work with them ________________________________
SN
Scott Nutter
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 3:29 PM

Keith, Iā€™m also one of the EL11 dual compressor user. I do plan to go with the Microlevel system. What is your opinion on the aftermarket air tanks
that can be mounted outside on a frame rail? They are expensive, but it would free up some storage space inside.
Scott.

Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless
water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas

Keith, Iā€™m also one of the EL11 dual compressor user. I do plan to go with the Microlevel system. What is your opinion on the aftermarket air tanks that can be mounted outside on a frame rail? They are expensive, but it would free up some storage space inside. Scott. -- Scott Nutter 1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI Houston, Texas
KV
Keith V
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 3:46 PM

Scott,
Do it, there are a lot of options for air tanks, they shouldn't be that expensive. You don't need a big one 1 gallon or so is pretty good.
Look online they are all the same. Stainless is fancy and expensive, but probably unnecessary. my 76 still has the original steel tank
But get the biggest compressor you can. no one has ever told me my compressor is too big!


From: Scott Nutter winoscott88@gmail.com
Sent: Friday, April 1, 2022 10:29 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2

Keith, Iā€™m also one of the EL11 dual compressor user. I do plan to go with the Microlevel system. What is your opinion on the aftermarket air tanks
that can be mounted outside on a frame rail? They are expensive, but it would free up some storage space inside.
Scott.

Scott Nutter
1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless
water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI
Houston, Texas


GMCnet mailing list
Unsubscribe or Change List Options:

Scott, Do it, there are a lot of options for air tanks, they shouldn't be that expensive. You don't need a big one 1 gallon or so is pretty good. Look online they are all the same. Stainless is fancy and expensive, but probably unnecessary. my 76 still has the original steel tank But get the biggest compressor you can. no one has ever told me my compressor is too big! ________________________________ From: Scott Nutter <winoscott88@gmail.com> Sent: Friday, April 1, 2022 10:29 AM To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org <gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2 Keith, Iā€™m also one of the EL11 dual compressor user. I do plan to go with the Microlevel system. What is your opinion on the aftermarket air tanks that can be mounted outside on a frame rail? They are expensive, but it would free up some storage space inside. Scott. -- Scott Nutter 1978 Royale Center Kitchen, Patterson 455, switch pitch tranny, 3.21 final drive, Quad bags, Dave Lenzi super duty mid axle disc brakes, tankless water heater, everything Lenzi. Alex Ferrera installed MSD Atomic EFI Houston, Texas _______________________________________________ GMCnet mailing list Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
JR
Jon Roche
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 4:01 PM

Russell,

I have had microlevel for a while now.  I am very happy with it.    I am not sure I would spend the money to replace a working system,  but most
systems have lots wrong with them, especially if you are dealing with leaky valves, and burnt up solenoids.  So when it comes time to fix it,  this
system simplifies the air lines, and system.  You have a compressor, small tank,  and 3 airlines.  a feed to air solenoid, and 1 each that goes to
each air bag.  less leak points.

Keith,  I am not sure what could be added....  it does exactly what it needs to do.  Travel, level,  and adjustability when you need it.  I would
only maybe switch to 4 buttons on the face like the remote,  rather then just the up and down.  so the remote ends up being just a bonus.

--
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/

Russell, I have had microlevel for a while now. I am very happy with it. I am not sure I would spend the money to replace a working system, but most systems have lots wrong with them, especially if you are dealing with leaky valves, and burnt up solenoids. So when it comes time to fix it, this system simplifies the air lines, and system. You have a compressor, small tank, and 3 airlines. a feed to air solenoid, and 1 each that goes to each air bag. less leak points. Keith, I am not sure what could be added.... it does exactly what it needs to do. Travel, level, and adjustability when you need it. I would only maybe switch to 4 buttons on the face like the remote, rather then just the up and down. so the remote ends up being just a bonus. -- Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/
KV
Keith V
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 4:26 PM

You know Jon,
I like that idea, put 2 rockers side by side, if you want both to go up press both, not too complicated.
That might be the big change


From: Jon Roche lqqkatjon@gmail.com
Sent: Friday, April 1, 2022 11:01 AM
To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org gmclist@list.gmcnet.org
Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2

Russell,

I have had microlevel for a while now.  I am very happy with it.    I am not sure I would spend the money to replace a working system,  but most
systems have lots wrong with them, especially if you are dealing with leaky valves, and burnt up solenoids.  So when it comes time to fix it,  this
system simplifies the air lines, and system.  You have a compressor, small tank,  and 3 airlines.  a feed to air solenoid, and 1 each that goes to
each air bag.  less leak points.

Keith,  I am not sure what could be added....  it does exactly what it needs to do.  Travel, level,  and adjustability when you need it.  I would
only maybe switch to 4 buttons on the face like the remote,  rather then just the up and down.  so the remote ends up being just a bonus.

--
Jon Roche
75 palm beach
EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now.
St. Cloud, MN
http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/


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Unsubscribe or Change List Options:

You know Jon, I like that idea, put 2 rockers side by side, if you want both to go up press both, not too complicated. That might be the big change ________________________________ From: Jon Roche <lqqkatjon@gmail.com> Sent: Friday, April 1, 2022 11:01 AM To: gmclist@list.gmcnet.org <gmclist@list.gmcnet.org> Subject: [GMCnet] Re: MicroLevel 2 Russell, I have had microlevel for a while now. I am very happy with it. I am not sure I would spend the money to replace a working system, but most systems have lots wrong with them, especially if you are dealing with leaky valves, and burnt up solenoids. So when it comes time to fix it, this system simplifies the air lines, and system. You have a compressor, small tank, and 3 airlines. a feed to air solenoid, and 1 each that goes to each air bag. less leak points. Keith, I am not sure what could be added.... it does exactly what it needs to do. Travel, level, and adjustability when you need it. I would only maybe switch to 4 buttons on the face like the remote, rather then just the up and down. so the remote ends up being just a bonus. -- Jon Roche 75 palm beach EBL EFI, manny headers, Micro Level, rebuilt most of coach now. St. Cloud, MN http://lqqkatjon.blogspot.com/ _______________________________________________ GMCnet mailing list Unsubscribe or Change List Options:
BV
Bill Van Vlack
Fri, Apr 1, 2022 4:31 PM

How about height above/below level displays in lieu of additional presets?

Bill Van Vlack
'76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid
November 2015.

How about height above/below level displays in lieu of additional presets? -- Bill Van Vlack '76 Royale; Guemes Island, Washington; Twin bed, full (DS) side bath, Brazilian Redwood counter and settee tops,455, 6KW generator; new owner a/o mid November 2015.